New Zealand tour of England - May/June 2015

[Deleted member 149013]

Yeah but he did score 300+ a few weeks ago!

Vince was good last year, but I don't think he's scored enough runs in his career to catch the attention of the selectors. Ales Hales should be playing every form of cricket for England. I'd like to see him lower down the order at Test Match level. It'd be great to have a top 3 who can give a good foundation, like Strauss, Cook and Trott used to do, and then have some explosive players lower down the order.

Does anyone know much about Sam Billings? I'd never heard of him until the Ireland match.

Like your way of thinking and Hales would be great down the order. I would reshuffle the current England team to this and bell would go with Ballance working on his technique with the coaches maybe a run in the Lions. This still wouldn’t solve our current lack of accurate spin.

Cook
Lyth
Taylor
Root
Buttler
Ali
Stokes
Hales
Wood
Broad
Anderson

On a separate note really impressed with New Zealand they don’t resolve to sledging and both teams played the game in a great spirit.

 

[cooks1st100]

So who are England's spin bowling options? As it's been pointed out that Ansari isn't a frontline spinner eithe,r the options as far as I'm aware are as follows:

Rashid,
Ali,
Tredwell,
Briggs,
Patel,
Kerrigan.

I've left out Panesar as a couple of comments in The Guardian alluded certain "problems" which appear to mean his career is over, most certainly in the international arena.

 

[dp458]

So who are England's spin bowling options? As it's been pointed out that Ansari isn't a frontline spinner eithe,r the options as far as I'm aware are as follows:

Rashid,
Ali,
Tredwell,
Briggs,
Patel,
Kerrigan.

I've left out Panesar as a couple of comments in The Guardian alluded certain "problems" which appear to mean his career is over, most certainly in the international arena.

Panesar has disciplline issues, and hasnt been bowling that great, Id actually consider Ansari at 6/7 he could split up the pure strokemakers and be solid if we need it, whilst being able to attack when needed, in terms of bowling he has more ability to bowl dry than any of the other options in my opinion, which would allow the seamers to attack, like 2005 when we had Giles.

Rashid and Ali are similar in terms of they give it a lot of revs but ccontrol is an issue, Ali stays over Adil, Samits bowling is just really non threatening

I also dont see them going for a pure bowler, unless they can trust broad to bat at 8, the only way would be if Woakes comes back in as 3rd seamer which is unlikely as he has only played a 2nd xi game fir warwicks in which he bowled 5 overs since his injury in the WC, as Woakes would arguably be the best batter at 8 in test match cricket worldwide. also tredwell couldnt get in his CC side last year, Kerrigan hasnt been turning up trees in Div 2,
we are really short on options

 

[dp458]

Like your way of thinking and Hales would be great down the order. I would reshuffle the current England team to this and bell would go with Ballance working on his technique with the coaches maybe a run in the Lions. This still wouldn’t solve our current lack of accurate spin.

Cook
Lyth
Taylor
Root
Buttler
Ali
Stokes
Hales
Wood
Broad
Anderson

On a separate note really impressed with New Zealand they don’t resolve to sledging and both teams played the game in a great spirit.

I think Ballance is fine, just not a 3, in the same way Root struggled up the order and at 3. Id like root at 4, ballance at 5

Hales wouldnt bat 8 if he came in, which id actually really like to see


my ashes squad

Cook
Lyth
Taylor/Hales/Bell
Root
Ballance
Buttler
Stokes
Ali/Woakes/Plunkett/Jordan
Wood
Broad
Anderson

With the potential bolter being Roy as he is in good nick, and has a chance to impress in the ODIs

 

[richowebbo]

So who are England's spin bowling options? As it's been pointed out that Ansari isn't a frontline spinner eithe,r the options as far as I'm aware are as follows:

Rashid,
Ali,
Tredwell,
Briggs,
Patel,
Kerrigan.

I've left out Panesar as a couple of comments in The Guardian alluded certain "problems" which appear to mean his career is over, most certainly in the international arena.

Scott Borthwick and Adam Riley are the other two.

I really like Tredwell. He only seems to be up for selection in limited overs which is strange. Maybe someone can shed some light as to why this is?

There are quite a lot of options for our line-up, which is great, but the team need time. I'd like to see the new gaffer pick an 11 and stick with it for a couple of years, including making Root captain so Cook can just concentrate on doing what he does best; making runs!

After being shouted at by Blockerdave for defending Bell, I'm scared to put him in my 11, so this would be my 11 for the future!

Cook
Lyth
Root (C)
Hales
Butler (W)
Ballance
Stokes
Tredwell or Moeen
Wood
Plunkett
Anderson

I hope that Chris Woakes will take over from Anderson when he eventually retires, as I don't think he did a lot wrong, and he can bat a bit as well.

I'll probably get slaughtered for leaving out Broad, but I've always really enjoyed watching Plunkett bowl (when he's not being told to constantly bowl bouncers!), and I think the Aussies will target Broad massively.

 

[_Sam_]

Billings hasn't done much this season to be honest. Made his name for smashing some runs in the one day tournament last year but didn't exactly outdo many in the CC or t20 and hasn't done a whole lot this season either.

Vince was quite possibly behind only Taylor as the next backup batsman at the start of the summer but that's changed pretty drastically now.

 

[dp458]

Scott Borthwick and Adam Riley are the other two.

I really like Tredwell. He only seems to be up for selection in limited overs which is strange. Maybe someone can shed some light as to why this is?

Riley keeps him out the Kent CC side thats all that needs to be said, when he got in the ODI team, he went more round arm, which isnt conducive to big spin, Borthwick doestn really bowl for durham, he is trying the steve smith transformation

There are quite a lot of options for our line-up, which is great, but the team need time. I'd like to see the new gaffer pick an 11 and stick with it for a couple of years, including making Root captain so Cook can just concentrate on doing what he does best; making runs!

After being shouted at by Blockerdave for defending Bell, I'm scared to put him in my 11, so this would be my 11 for the future!

Cook
Lyth
Root (C)
Hales
Butler (W)
Ballance
Stokes
Tredwell or Moeen
Wood
Plunkett
Anderson

Id swap Ballance and Buttler and Root and Hales

I hope that Chris Woakes will take over from Anderson when he eventually retires, as I don't think he did a lot wrong, and he can bat a bit as well.

Thats whats going to happen i think, he is the best swing bowler apart from anderson in the country, and really should have took the new ball ahead of broad last summer, youre underselling his batting drastically, Stokes 10Fc 100s @34.74, Woakes 8 100s @37.87. Plus i think Jimmy might go after this mammoth year, as he will have a lot of bowling to do,and he might just reach breaking point

I'll probably get slaughtered for leaving out Broad, but I've always really enjoyed watching Plunkett bowl (when he's not being told to constantly bowl bouncers!), and I think the Aussies will target Broad massively

Broad blows hot and cold, and until someone is consistent better than broad, ill leave him in, Plunkett just doesnt do enough for me, he can scare championship batsman with pace, but that isnt enoguh in tests look at mitch johnson before the last ashes
.

 

[richowebbo]

I think Borthwick bowled a fair bit last year and from memory bowled quite well. I know Swann was talking him up, but he is a batsmen as well, and I haven't really followed the CC this year, so I'll take you word for it.

As I said in an earlier post, I'd like the top 3 to have stability and then a bit of power come in, hence Hales and then Butler. Ballance could then add some stability a bit further down the order.

When I said Woakes can "bat a bit" I didn't mean it literally, it was just an expression of sorts. He can definitely bat, and is also the best swing bowler we have apart from Jimmy. Is he injured at the moment? He isn't in the one day side yet they've picked Finn and Jordan who are nowhere near as good as him with the ball or bat.

And look at Mitch Johnson now! I watched a lot of Plunkett last year for Yorkshire and his line, length and seed were all very good.

 

[Markkkkk]

I would put Briggs as the spinner. No reason, just he took over 100 5 wicket hauls in my ICC game!

 

[_Sam_]

I would put Briggs as the spinner. No reason, just he took over 100 5 wicket hauls in my ICC game!

Conveniently just took his 150th FC wicket after getting back in Hampshire's team over Fidel Edwards (Unless he's picked up a niggle I'm not sure about). Little way to go for those 100 5 wicket hauls though .

 

[dp458]

I think Borthwick bowled a fair bit last year and from memory bowled quite well. I know Swann was talking him up, but he is a batsmen as well, and I haven't really followed the CC this year, so I'll take you word for it.

As I said in an earlier post, I'd like the top 3 to have stability and then a bit of power come in, hence Hales and then Butler. Ballance could then add some stability a bit further down the order.

When I said Woakes can "bat a bit" I didn't mean it literally, it was just an expression of sorts. He can definitely bat, and is also the best swing bowler we have apart from Jimmy. Is he injured at the moment? He isn't in the one day side yet they've picked Finn and Jordan who are nowhere near as good as him with the ball or bat.

And look at Mitch Johnson now! I watched a lot of Plunkett last year for Yorkshire and his line, length and seed were all very good.

Borthwick bowled well in Championship at the back end of last year, however early season and up at durham, he hasnt done much bowling, has been really good with the bat though

Thats a good idea, but what about the turgid starts that then put pressure on the strokemakers to bat 'sensibily' to not get out and all of a sudden we are 60-5

Woakes is recovering from his foot stress fracture from the WC, also had some other surgery that he was playing through, has played a 2nd xi game for us last week, and will be back with the 1st team soon starting off as a batting all rounder i suspect given the warwicks batting injury issues atm, probably fit for the Ashes, and will most likely be Woods replacement when he breaks down, as wood looks like ryan harris, good but injury prone, just going off how his pace went off at headingly

I havent seen Plunkett live since his sort of revival 3 or so years ago, was just a passing remark from what england made him bowl last summer

 

[dp458]

Conveniently just took his 150th FC wicket after getting back in Hampshire's team over Fidel Edwards (Unless he's picked up a niggle I'm not sure about). Little way to go for those 100 5 wicket hauls though .

Again not really a big turner of the ball, consistent control is what counties prefer, in my trial at edgbaston last year along with about 10 other league spinners, for the U20 side, they openly say about wwanting control, look at Tahir in tests, produces some rip snorters, but at that level batters wait on the long hop and just dispatch it

 

[_Sam_]

Again not really a big turner of the ball, consistent control is what counties prefer, in my trial at edgbaston last year along with about 10 other league spinners, for the U20 side, they openly say about wwanting control, look at Tahir in tests, produces some rip snorters, but at that level batters wait on the long hop and just dispatch it

Think that's largely to do with the advent of t20 cricket nowadays. Flatter quicker spinners are more effective than those that chuck it up in most cases in the format.

 

[richowebbo]

Borthwick bowled well in Championship at the back end of last year, however early season and up at durham, he hasnt done much bowling, has been really good with the bat though

Thats a good idea, but what about the turgid starts that then put pressure on the strokemakers to bat 'sensibily' to not get out and all of a sudden we are 60-5

Woakes is recovering from his foot stress fracture from the WC, also had some other surgery that he was playing through, has played a 2nd xi game for us last week, and will be back with the 1st team soon starting off as a batting all rounder i suspect given the warwicks batting injury issues atm, probably fit for the Ashes, and will most likely be Woods replacement when he breaks down, as wood looks like ryan harris, good but injury prone, just going off how his pace went off at headingly

I havent seen Plunkett live since his sort of revival 3 or so years ago, was just a passing remark from what england made him bowl last summer

That could, and probably will happen at some point. But you could fill a team with 11 sensible, so to speak, batsmen and they could get pinned back and we could be all out for 80! I just like the idea of having a solid base at the top with bit of flair in the middle. You can always change the order depending on scenarios, and Butler showed in the 2nd Innings at Headingly he can play defensively.

You got it spot on by saying "what England made him bowl". I think he can quality if he's allowed to bowl line and length. With the increasing amount of T20 games, short balls don't really work anymore. Most teams bat to 9 or 10 and can counter attack short stuff. The lack of balls hitting the stumps in the last test Match was shocking.

 

[swacker]

Ballance is a tough one - his record essentially over the same period as Bell has been excellent, but some of his dismissals in this series have been shocking.

I think the lack of any proper alternatives at the moment to Ballance or Bell is a real hindrance. I do think England should stick by Ballance, like they did with Bell 10 years ago. However Bell is a different proposition. His last 10 tests or so he's been poor. Experience shouldn't be the only thing keeping him in the team. However right now it is.