Trans-Tasman Trophy (NZ in Australia), December 2011/12
- Thread starter Gurjot95
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midgetwars
Club Captain
Ahh...
Hughes Drops another. Hopefully he himself will be dropped.
Hughes Drops another. Hopefully he himself will be dropped.
formula1man
International Cricketer
I think New Zealand's best XI is
1. B. Watling / T. McIntosh
2. M. Guptil
3. K. Williamson
4. R. Taylor
5. B. McCullum
6. D. Brownlie
7. D. Vettori
8. R. Young
9. T. Southee
10. D. Bracewell
11. C. Martin
However I would like to see McCullum keep. If Young has to keep I would like him to open to keep Ryder, Vettori moving up to 3 wouldnt be that strange.
Australia need to slowly move towards this
1. D. Warner
2. E. Cowan
3. S. Marsh
4. M. Clarke
5. S. Watson
6. T. Cooper
7. M. Wade
8. R. Harris
9. J. Pattinson
10. P. Cummins
11. N. Lyon
You could also consider P. Hughes after he has a shield spell, U. Khawaja, P. Forrest and D. Christian, M. Marsh will be Watson's replacement. Bowlers; B. Hilfenhaus, P. Siddle, D. Bollinger, T. Copeland, B. Cutting need to be considered.
1. B. Watling / T. McIntosh
2. M. Guptil
3. K. Williamson
4. R. Taylor
5. B. McCullum
6. D. Brownlie
7. D. Vettori
8. R. Young
9. T. Southee
10. D. Bracewell
11. C. Martin
However I would like to see McCullum keep. If Young has to keep I would like him to open to keep Ryder, Vettori moving up to 3 wouldnt be that strange.
Australia need to slowly move towards this
1. D. Warner
2. E. Cowan
3. S. Marsh
4. M. Clarke
5. S. Watson
6. T. Cooper
7. M. Wade
8. R. Harris
9. J. Pattinson
10. P. Cummins
11. N. Lyon
You could also consider P. Hughes after he has a shield spell, U. Khawaja, P. Forrest and D. Christian, M. Marsh will be Watson's replacement. Bowlers; B. Hilfenhaus, P. Siddle, D. Bollinger, T. Copeland, B. Cutting need to be considered.
midgetwars
Club Captain
I mislike teams that have Watson lower down the order - it's touted as the 'smart' thing to do by the experts but I disagree completely: 1) he's really done very well as an opener compared to everywhere else he's batted, 2) it suits him well because he looks dodgy when he starts against spin and 3) the stats show that his bowling doesn't affect his batting ie. his averages in the 2nd innings of games are higher than the 1st - so obviously the whole fatigued from bowling thing is rubbish. The real issue is who is going to partner him. I think Khawaja could be the best option personally, I'd just like to see him get a few more games against good bowling to see how good his technique actually is. Today it didn't look that great, but he seems to have the kind of mindset I like though. Hughes and Warner usually put on a clinic of going too hard too early - that's poor opening. eg. Ian Chappell was too busy overpraising Warner's aggression to realise that trying to hit 5 balls of Boult's opening over to the cover fence may not have been the most prudent approach from Dave - especially when he missed most of them...
Anyway, I think Australia is close to getting the most talented guys out there, they just really have to solve the consistency problem. The commentators mentioned it was on track to be Australia's 4th score of under 100 in only a couple of years. Why is that happening? Because apart from those tragic collapses the batting seems reasonable enough: Clarke, Ponting, Hussey all have good records and plenty of experience. The other guys are talented enough - why do they all fail at the same time?
And I was really unhappy with Lyon's usage. I thought Clarke might have been a breath of fresh air for the spinners, but Lyons's always the 4th (or 5th) bowler turned too, and this afternoon got 3 overs before getting hooked. He wasn't looking overly threatening I'll admit, but he's generally quite tidy and he makes the batsmen change their approach and try different things so I thought he was worth turning to earlier and for longer.
Anyway, I think Australia is close to getting the most talented guys out there, they just really have to solve the consistency problem. The commentators mentioned it was on track to be Australia's 4th score of under 100 in only a couple of years. Why is that happening? Because apart from those tragic collapses the batting seems reasonable enough: Clarke, Ponting, Hussey all have good records and plenty of experience. The other guys are talented enough - why do they all fail at the same time?
And I was really unhappy with Lyon's usage. I thought Clarke might have been a breath of fresh air for the spinners, but Lyons's always the 4th (or 5th) bowler turned too, and this afternoon got 3 overs before getting hooked. He wasn't looking overly threatening I'll admit, but he's generally quite tidy and he makes the batsmen change their approach and try different things so I thought he was worth turning to earlier and for longer.
Great bowling? They're playing NZ on a seamers paradise.
StinkyBoHoon
National Board President
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Ian chappell was talking nonsense for most of yesterdays play. you just wonder if his slightly wreckless attitude isn't something that's derivative of the general thinking of the coaches and players because no one seemed willing to play with any application.
Clarke left a shocker but he was the only one playing with his head and still chappell felt necessary to put the boot in and say "he'd rather get out caught in the slips playing his strokes" no ian, he just would rather not get out I think.
Hughes' time has to be up yeah? he's not particularly good and making a bowling plan to him could be used as a introductory training exercise by bowling coaches such is painful obviousness of it and lack of complexity involved in its execution.
Clarke left a shocker but he was the only one playing with his head and still chappell felt necessary to put the boot in and say "he'd rather get out caught in the slips playing his strokes" no ian, he just would rather not get out I think.
Hughes' time has to be up yeah? he's not particularly good and making a bowling plan to him could be used as a introductory training exercise by bowling coaches such is painful obviousness of it and lack of complexity involved in its execution.
swacker
Chairman of Selectors
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@sifter132: Watson is a big lad so bowling too many overs is going to take it's toll as it did with Freddie. As a fifth bowler he shouldn't have to do too much in most games and should be bowling short spells only really just to break things up or keep control with a bit of three/four pace line and length.
I think opener is the right place for him because he does look the part. If you got two quality openers then he could drop to six and play more aggressively but right now he is probably your banker opening batsman. I think he is a really good allrounder.
Yeah, agree about the 5th bowler option but he's been bowling much more than that recently. That was prior to the youngies being in the team though so hopefully those days are behind us. When he emerged on the scene, I remember him as a decent bowler and a powerful hitter lower down the order. Would be good to see him return to that but it's also encouraging to know he can handle the new ball too.
I think opener is the right place for him because he does look the part. If you got two quality openers then he could drop to six and play more aggressively but right now he is probably your banker opening batsman. I think he is a really good allrounder.
Yeah, agree about the 5th bowler option but he's been bowling much more than that recently. That was prior to the youngies being in the team though so hopefully those days are behind us. When he emerged on the scene, I remember him as a decent bowler and a powerful hitter lower down the order. Would be good to see him return to that but it's also encouraging to know he can handle the new ball too.
midgetwars
Club Captain
Ponting, Clarke and Hussey are prone to collapses. I remember in the 06/07 ashes when all 3 got out to less than 10 runs along with the rest of team. Save by Hayden/Symonds
4th Test: Australia v England at Melbourne, Dec 26-28, 2006 | Cricket Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo
4th Test: Australia v England at Melbourne, Dec 26-28, 2006 | Cricket Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo
formula1man
International Cricketer
I just dont like how we put openers down the order and open with middle order players, yes you do it if you have no talent in your country but we have pplenty of openers to open for us without having to use an allrounder who tbh as much as I love Watson has only scored the one hundred.
Doodlesweaver
Club Cricketer
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Yep, still all to play for. The Aussies could quite easily sneak this match if they get one of the batsmen early. Pitch is looking a fair bit more batsman friendly so the Aussies will fancy their chances.
Yeah he was banging on about it with Dave Warner too which I think I mentioned. Warner aims big cover drives in the 2nd over of the day with overcast skies, moving ball, missed 3 or 4 of them and Chappell praises his approach. I just started laughing when Warner nicked one a couple of overs later going for a big straight drive.
The thing with the Clarke dismissal was that a couple of balls earlier he'd played and missed at one that he shouldn't have tried to play, and he obviously told himself to be a bit more careful, try and leave more. Now he took that too far of course, but not one of the commentators tried to mention that sort of mind game that Clarke would have been playing with himself.
But yeah the commentary...Far too often they get caught talking about what should be happening rather than what is. For example, Mitchell Starc comes round the wicket and the commentators are falling over themselves to tell the viewers how bad an idea it is - removes out the natural angle of the left armer, takes LBW out of it blah blah (never mind that Starc got very close late in the day to an LBW...). This happened in at least 2 commentary stints. But not one of them tried to explain why he might have been going around the wicket, so what message does that send to the viewers? That the Australian team/Starc is stupid for doing something so obviously wrong? There must be a reason or he wouldn't have done it a couple of times, but of course none of the commentators will bother asking Starc or Clarke or Arthur about it after play - they'll just come back tomorrow and criticise again...
As for Watson, yeah I'm with you Swacker it's when and how he bowls that's key, not where he bats. I think Australia relies on him too much with ball, he should be bowling 10 overs a day tops - 2 x 5 over spells. One with the new ball, one with a reversing older ball. Less bowling will keep him fresher and more impactful. Use Lyon more Pup instead of Watson/Hussey!!!
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