India in England/Ireland/Scotland

[Vcassano]

As a full time spinner I'd have thought the first things you would develop would be the leg-spinner and the off-spinner?

EDIT: You isn't meant personally, just think out loud.

 

[Adarsh]

In ODI cricket the batsmen will easily pick up an off spinner if you're a legspinner and vice versa. That's why the googly and the doosra were developed ! The whole point is to keep the action very similar. Bowling an off spinner instead of a googly defeats the purpose. It may work in club cricket, but certainly not in ODIs.

 

[Will_NA]

Shahid Afridi does it quite well and so does Sachin

 

[sohum]

i am so angry at india's bowlers. i mean how can you lose from having england 114-7? simply ridiculous....

Didn't we have Pakistan 36/6 recently in a test match and lose that also? It is not a highly improbable occurrence.

how many of you feel irfan pathan and mohd. kaif should be brought back ??

So that we can dig into them again if they end up failing? I'm first in line for that. :

 

[Animator!]

Just because a player has had once chance and not taken it doesn't mean they should be discarded forever. That's a ridiculous notion. You have to remember, some of the Worlds greats have been dropped; Ricky Ponting, Justin Langer, Steve Waugh the lis goes on.

 

[sohum]

I think spinners over complicate things sometimes.
I'm a leg spinner, and I normally get wickets with a suprise off spinner, more than I get one with a googly.

So I reckon Panesar should work on bowling a chinaman.
Wainwright, the Yorkshire left armer, bowls chinaman and slow left arm, keeps the batsman guessing.

I would think the best batsmen would be able to pick the grip out of the hand if you switch between standard off-spinners and leg-spinners. The thing about the googly is that it comes out of the back of the hand so although you can still pick it out of the hand, you have less time to do so. Also, I would presume that bowling an off-spinner instead of the googly, it would be easy to pick the revs on the ball since you would probably be spinning it along the seam? Not sure about that though.

Just because a player has had once chance and not taken it doesn't mean they should be discarded forever. That's a ridiculous notion. You have to remember, some of the Worlds greats have been dropped; Ricky Ponting, Justin Langer, Steve Waugh the lis goes on.

My point is not that they should not be given another chance. My point is that when they fail again (which they will invariably do because no one is perfect) everyone will be asking them to be axed and the previous drops to come back. It has happened too often in Indian cricket to refute it. Just take the examples of Sehwag and Harbhajan who have been in and out of the team. When Sehwag hit a bad patch, everyone asked for his head. Then the team played badly so they brought him back. Then he again wasn't able to convert so they threw him out. Now they are asking for him again.

 

[legspinner@fred]

I would think the best batsmen would be able to pick the grip out of the hand if you switch between standard off-spinners and leg-spinners. The thing about the googly is that it comes out of the back of the hand so although you can still pick it out of the hand, you have less time to do so. Also, I would presume that bowling an off-spinner instead of the googly, it would be easy to pick the revs on the ball since you would probably be spinning it along the seam? Not sure about that though.

You don't need to do it every other ball.
Maybe twice a match?
If 59 balls have been legspinners, just lob up an off spinner if you feel the batsman has settled.

Ashley Giles once said that the ability to bowl a chinamen is a useful trick, whether you hide it or not.
When I bowl my googly I bend my wrist as far back as physically possible, with an off spiner i'll hide the ball behind my left hand untill the last second.

Tendulkar bowls all sorts, that is what makes his bowling differant, so it's something that can just be tried.
Think Sobers, what did he bowl?
Absoloutely everything.
Just try it sometimes, Murali did it last year V South Africa, baffled the top order batsman.

As a full time spinner I'd have thought the first things you would develop would be the leg-spinner and the off-spinner?

EDIT: You isn't meant personally, just think out loud.

Correct, that's why you can bowl them both.

 

[sohum]

You don't need to do it every other ball.
Maybe twice a match?
If 59 balls have been legspinners, just lob up an off spinner if you feel the batsman has settled.

Ashley Giles once said that the ability to bowl a chinamen is a useful trick, whether you hide it or not.
When I bowl my googly I bend my wrist as far back as physically possible, with an off spiner i'll hide the ball behind my left hand untill the last second.

Tendulkar bowls all sorts, that is what makes his bowling differant, so it's something that can just be tried.
Think Sobers, what did he bowl?
Absoloutely everything.
Just try it sometimes, Murali did it last year V South Africa, baffled the top order batsman.

Yes, it would be useful but I think you'd have to be pretty good to be able to make it accurate enough to be effective. Tendulkar can do almost anything with a cricket ball except hurl it at 80+ mph (except from the outfield ) but you'll notice that he has very little control, bowling full tosses and short balls all the time.

 

[legspinner@fred]

Rough with the smooth, now and again he'll bowl a magic ball.
If you have the time to practice every form of spin, it can be pretty accurate.

 

[sohum]

Rough with the smooth, now and again he'll bowl a magic ball.
If you have the time to practice every form of spin, it can be pretty accurate.

It's a good variation to have but I don't think it is necessarily more effective than the standard googly or doosra. There are so many more factors coming into play when you are bowling an off-spin vs. leg-spin rather than a googly vs. legspin. I don't think you would survive internationally without a googly as a leg-spin bowler, even if you knew how to bowl decent off-spinners. Video analysis would quickly figure out any changes in your action that the batsmen could then use to figure out what type of ball was coming.

 

[legspinner@fred]

Yes, but if your going to use it for the first time, then fine.
People will go 'oh look Panesar has a doosra better watch out for that'.

Maybe, you'll just bowl it once a test match, Murali bowled it twice in a test and almost got two wickets with a leg spinner, it's just a suprise.

leg break, googly, googly, offbreak, legbreak, legbreak.
That could be an over to bowl if your really struggling.

 

[Adarsh]

Woo! I'm going to watch the match on Sunday. Watch out for me on tv.

 

[Eddie]

apparently Zaheer khan is a doubt for tomorrow with a bad ankle..

thats a bit of a blow..imagine patel and agarkar opening the bowling..

 

[Adarsh]

RP Singh will probably open if Zaheer isn't there.

 

[Leggie]

RP Singh will probably open if Zaheer isn't there.

oh well, at least we have agarkar back in form....