India in England/Ireland/Scotland

[angryangy]

Floodlights don't work for Tests. Any time a ground in Australia resorts to the lights, the batsmen will soon be offered the light or, probably more likely, rain strikes (as it did today, mind you). Floodlights aren't very bright compared to the Sun, even through good cloud cover and the dark red ball is simply not suited to low-light conditions.

At lower levels or informally, one might be happy to play until they can barely see (evidently they're trialling this in the World Cup), but at the top level, even though it might be safe to play, it eventually becomes quite unfair.

But if they can produce enough light for ODIs to play Day/Night games then surely they are suitable for Tests?

Nope, test cricket needs lots more light and both your eyes and television can do a good job of fooling you as to how bright things are. Floodlights give much better light than night, but not better light than daytime. Even though things look clear to you in either case, less light means less vision, or less ability to pick up movements as soon as they happen.

The shiny white ball counters this as it is much easier to see. You will notice that the not so shiny ball gets replaced by a clean ball of similar age to aid the batsmen.

In Aussie Rules, a game also played predominantly with a red leather ball in daylight, a yellow ball is used for floodlit games.

 

[sohum]

I have no further desire to argue with you sohum, since you pick up each of my points and disagree for the sake of disagreeing. It seems to me that you take special pleasure in argument for whatever reason. I don't.

I do not disagree for the sake of disagreeing, but because I actually disagree with many of the points you bring to the table. This tends to happen when two people with opinions at other ends of the spectrum discuss a topic, wouldn't you say? I don't take pleasure in argument, but I won't let something that is posted, that I disagree with vehemently, go.

Even cricket itself doesn't excite me as it used to, and I now see the game for what it is: a boring game played by 22 fools watched by... anyway you get my point.

I feel interest in cricket is always going to decrease as one gets older and other things in life take higher precedence.

India will keep winning a few games here and there and lose a lot more than they win. I don't claim "ownership" of Indian cricket as you seem to think and my main point was why people continue to patronize this game to the exclusion of all others and that is why the game's administrators are so smug and secure... Yes, other games may not be as popular in India, but have the fans really given other games a chance? Yet we are so accepting of mediocrity in cricket and ignore other sports where India is equally mediocre but improving over time.

Singular mediocrity in Indian cricket is not something I agree with. I feel we keep improving and getting worse as time goes. How else would you explain us reaching the 2003 World Cup final just 4 years back? We were unbeaten except against Australia. Bar Australia, no team has been superior to the others consistently and I think singling out the Indian team for failing to maintain such a shrewd level of consistency is unfair.

I know I, personally, have given other games the chance. I follow as many sports as I can given my time constraints. Hockey was the one sport that was starting to gain popularity before IHF went ahead and destroyed the development (coupled together, obviously, with Jugraj Singh's freak accident). Apart from that, we are really poor, not even mediocre, in other sports. Football (soccer) enjoys headlines as one coach is fired and another is picked up, yet the players still don't seem to perform remarkably better. TV coverage of EPL and European leagues has meant that more young Indians play football rather than cricket, and this is positive for the future.

Basketball--DD used to show the state tournaments about 5 years back. I watched every minute of action that I could. They stopped showing it after that (or perhaps they showed it in the middle of the night). What I saw then wasn't very promising, but hopefully we will keep improving.

The fact remains that cricket is the ONLY sport that India plays, as a nation, that is worthy of international recognition. While we may not be that good with respect to the top 5 nations in the world, just the fact that we make it around there means that we are good enough. Besides, it's not that cricket in India is stagnating, it is just that other teams are improving at a quicker level.

 

[harishankar]

Thanks, Sohum. Good points there...

Hopefully we can disagree without any bad feeling on this issue. I enjoy reading your points. It was just that I felt that some of my points were misunderstood.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not a cricket hater - it's just that I feel they need to move into a different era... from politicians running the game to professionals...

As for other sports, it's like a catch-22 situation - until there is funding, there won't be any improvement and public interest. But there won't be funding until public interest in the sport grows.

As for the current series, I still think it's an uphill task to win a test match here.

 

[manee]

Don't get me wrong - I'm not a cricket hater - it's just that I feel they need to move into a different era... from politicians running the game to professionals...

See: Indian Cricket League

This seems like it is going to be run by former professionals.

 

[harishankar]

See: Indian Cricket League

This seems like it is going to be run by former professionals.

I know about that and I seriously hope that becomes a success.

 

[m_vaughan]

After going through Sohum's and harishankar's views I have to admit that both of them are correct in their own reasoning. As much as the state of other sports has improved in recent times, it is no secret that the domination of Cricket has seriously hampered them. Its not Cricket's fault, but just something really unfortunate.

 

[Adarsh]

Ganguly may be out for the next test due to a bad back. I hope it's true, it'll be a blessing in disguise for India. Yuvraj deserves a place in the team.

 

[Sureshot]

The fact remains that cricket is the ONLY sport that India plays, as a nation, that is worthy of international recognition. While we may not be that good with respect to the top 5 nations in the world, just the fact that we make it around there means that we are good enough. Besides, it's not that cricket in India is stagnating, it is just that other teams are improving at a quicker level.

India have got a decent Hockey Team. Or at least did have, 8 gold medals.

 

[MasterBlaster76]

Lords's doesn't have Floodlights.

It should have floods, since it's the 'Home of Cricket'! I'm sick of our chances being ruined by bad light! There's no excuse for Lords not having floodlights.

I'm aware that the red ball isn't easy to see under floodlights, but surely there has to be a solution, a hi-vis red ball, brighter red or something like that. We can't do anything about rain, but surely bad light can be tackled somehow.

Also, do you remember a few years back when England beat Pakistan in Pakistan? It was almost pitch dark and still they played on.

 

[Animator!]

The residents around the ground will not allow it. You have to remember that people live right next to Lords. People have to sleep and things, so they will not support the building of Floodlights because Lords needs to residents planning permission to do so. It's the reason why 20Twenty isn't played at Lords because the residents don't support it, because of the playing of loud music.

 

[MasterBlaster76]

Looking back at it, and what happened after it, The Daily Mail are right, England were robbed. All papers over-exaggerate though, this is no exception.

No, I don't think the pitch at Trent Bridge will be too good. The groundsmen will have spent so long pumping the outfield they would not have had time to prepare the pitch too much.

It's time we had replays using Hawkeye for close LBWs such as Panesar's on the last day, as that cost us the match.

One huge positive of that match was our bowling attack, they were great! Now, Harmison, Flintoff, Hoggard and Jones will be under massive pressure and this can only be good for English cricket. Not to mention Monty...are there any other spinners out there who can match him in England?

 

[Animator!]

No, not at all. I'm completely against technology in sport. Where would all the talking points after the game be? Gone. It'd be ridiculously boring. One of the best viewings in Cricket is seeing someone getting a let off then going onto get a ton. Imagine if we did use tecnhology; Dravid wouldn't have been given out in the second innings, he could well and probably would have gone on a scored at ton. Meaning we wouldn't get near winning the game. Just because one decision goes against your country doesnt mean that all of a sudden we need to use technology. It'd slow down the pace and the flow of the game. It'd cost bowling sides chances to bowl more overs and many other things that would go against the side appealing for the decision.

 

[andrew_nixon]

The residents around the ground will not allow it. You have to remember that people live right next to Lords. People have to sleep and things, so they will not support the building of Floodlights because Lords needs to residents planning permission to do so. It's the reason why 20Twenty isn't played at Lords because the residents don't support it, because of the playing of loud music.

Twenty20 is played at Lord's. Middlesex played Surrey and Essex there this year for example.

There are also plans to host a Day/Night match next season, and plans to install permanent floodlights by 2010.

 

[aditya123]

Also, do you remember a few years back when England beat Pakistan in Pakistan? It was almost pitch dark and still they played on.

That was because England were the batting side in that case and they stayed on because they were close to victory.It was Hussain and Thorpe who were batting if my memory serves me right.
It was Pakistan who were trying to waste time and praying for bad-light until Bucknor intervened and asked them to stop wasting time.

I can give you another instance, of the India-England Leeds test in 2002 when Tendulkar and Ganguly did not accept the light and stayed on in almost pitch darkness as they wanted to amass quick runs to enable them to declare.
They managed 100+ runs in an hour that they stayed on for but he umpires eventually called play off as it was dangerous for the fielding side.

India have got a decent Hockey Team. Or at least did have, 8 gold medals.

We had 8 consecutive gold medals in the Olympics but that was when Hockey was played on grass.
Since the time that Hockey has been played on astroturf, India and Pakistan have steadily declined in hockey.
We have`nt caught up with the fast-paced hockey that the Europeans and the Aussies play.

We`ve shown sparks of a revival in hockey but have faded away.
Indian hockey is a lot like Caribbean cricket, a glorious past but a dodgy current situation.

 

[sohum]

Don't get me wrong - I'm not a cricket hater - it's just that I feel they need to move into a different era... from politicians running the game to professionals...

I completely agree. I'm sick and tired of the politics that has entered the Indian game, especially completely without subtlety over the last few years. Earlier, at least the politics was kept under covers, but now we see politicians like Sharad Pawar and Laloo Prasad Yadav in charge of cricket organizations and that is not something I like. I don't think boycotting cricket is the way to protest against that, however, because I don't think it will lead to a rightly organized revolution.

As for the current series, I still think it's an uphill task to win a test match here.

Definitely it is, but England have been dominant at home since the Ashes loss. Not being able to win a match or the series should not reflect poorly on us because we are clearly underdogs going into this series.

India have got a decent Hockey Team. Or at least did have, 8 gold medals.

They had the top, or one of the top, hockey teams in the world until the introduction of Astroturf. Now we find it difficult to compete with the best in the world. When it seemed like our old successes were coming back a few years back, a combination of poor management and bad luck pushed us back down. We did play well in our most recent tournament, though.